WFMU: This Is The Modern World with Trouble: Playlist from August 13, 2009

Listener comments!
	9:03am annie: good morning trouble...
	9:05am trouble: good morning annie! good morning all!
	9:14am dale: another fine summer day in the northeast. the music warms things up, however.
	9:21am listener mark: good morning everyone wow, I wake up, turn on the stereo, and get hit with "I'll never let you go" Interesting way to start my day.
	9:33am annie: mark, thanks for your help with my mouse issues!! i have anew laser mouse now..
	9:33am Laurie: If it's any consolation, it's very gray and dreary looking here in Miami. By the by, how did you like Julie & Julia?
	9:37am cornliquordrinker: GOOD LAWD!
	9:37am listener mark: you 're welcome annie. How's the garden with all the rain? I must say I've got all sorts of mushrooms popping up under the trees! Strange looking!
	9:41am trouble: julie and julia: meryl streep was fantastic and charming. the julia story was presented so much better than the julie powell story. julie was made all vanilla and weepy. not like the book at all! i would highly suggest reading both the books; "julie and julia", and "my life in france".
	9:44am jiveass: Swinscoe is nice and nasteee. keep it up
	9:44am annie: mark, it has been soggy and pitiful. it seems the only things that have been happy are the carrots. the fingerlings i planted went to the blight, but the second planting of sets seems to have avoided it. i will have a fallcrop of new potatoes... i have discovered a small red mushroom in the hickory sapling grove over in the sahed area. they are tiny little things, not edible..
	9:58am Cecile: I agree, trouble, but I enjoyed it anyway. Filmmakers have a hard time portraying prickly women as likeable. And it's Nora Ephron directing. She's not so great with complexity... I also missed the omnipresence of Buffy the Vampire Slayer - in the book they are always watching Buffy.
	10:01am trouble: i agree cecile. it was enjoyable, but i always want the big cinematic experience when i see a film on the big screen vs renting netflix, i guess...
	10:07am Cecile: I had a lovely time. i went with a friend who wasn't that familiar with either, and he was enchanted so that made it for me. I agree, she should probably be doing TV movies. I like a lot of her other works much better on TV. And just think, you can netflix it and skip to all the Julia bits!
	10:17am Cecile: Sorry, killed the board. ;) Hey, trouble, did you get Season 2 of FOTC yet?
	10:18am Devin: Good morning everyone! It's thursday already?
	10:21am Cecile: randy newman wrote this song, right?
	10:25am north guinea hills: a new sandy bull release? Wow! Is it a rerelease newly found archival material?
	10:25am trouble: yes randy newman wrote i think it's going to rain. and the Flight of the conchords is on my queue, soon, soon, soon.
	10:25am listener mark: Trouble, I ordered two alice coltrane cd's "Journey In Satchidananda " and "Ptah The El Daoud" thanks for playing Alice on your radio programme.
	10:25am north guinea hills: *rerelease OR newly found archival material.
	10:27am listener mark: trouble? are you battling the plumber?
	10:30am listener mark: the noisy plumber?
	10:32am Listener Dave from NH: I suspect that the people behind the rubber room rerub are not Chicago's Rubberroom. But who knows? Maybe they've lightened up.
	10:32am PMD: Hi all--- I was away from the station yesterday, but wanted to wish Carmichael happy birthday!
	10:34am Cecile: YES BEEFHEART Happy Birthday Carm!
	10:37am what?: we queued up early and got our FOTC fix on Tuesday. it's a novel experience to (for once) get a netflix disc that isn't so scratched up i have to break out the toothpaste. first two or three episodes were a bit disappointing, but they seem to have hit their stride by the end of the first disc.
	10:39am trouble: listener mark, congratulations for entering the hallowed halls of alice coltrane. and yes i am battling the plumber, and i am winning
	10:40am Cecile: The second episode? That's astonishing! Watch it again! Sugalumps? The New Cup? But I agree, the series was a little bit wobbly at first. And the Michel Gondry ep (Unnatural Love) is brilliant. Yeah, a clean Netflix disc is awesome. I got a How I Met Your Mother (shut UP!) disc that looked like it had been dragged thru gravel by a 20 mule team.
	10:41am Cecile: Tell me about using toothpaste, though, to fix a bad disc.
	10:42am Adrian in London: (whispers) Am I the only person who just doesn't get FOTC?
	10:43am Cecile: No. You are not the only one.
	10:45am north guinea hills: classic skylab, nice! brings back memories....
	10:48am wha?: 'lil bit of toothpaste on the fingertip. 'lil bit of water on the disc. rub in tight circles (2-3 mm diameter) all around the disc. rinse and dry. it seems to work on all but most seriously pitted problem discs. forget where i heard about this technique first. i would never have tried it with my own discs, but then i don't subject my own discs to the 20-mule team (LOL, by the way) treatment.
	10:50am Cecile: Thanks!
	10:50am patrick: good morning trouble! im looking forward to seeing you!
	10:52am Listener Dave from NH: Whenever I hear the name Skylab, I always think of the old Ed Rush tune first (because I heard the song before I heard of the group) and then I'm invariably kind of taken aback for a moment by what I hear because where's the gnarly bass and the rolling drums?
	10:54am steve krinsky: Oumou is quite the presence in the Bela Fleck goes to Africa movie ("Throw Down Your Heart"); to see here walking through the streets of Bamako is a sight. And then she sings!
	10:56am trouble: good morning patrick! I am thrilled to be soon entering the great state of maine...
	11:02am Cecile: wow, space age doo-wop love it
	11:02am trouble: oumou sangare definitley has the look of someone who has tred this earth before...thousands of years of history in those hips.
	11:03am listener doug: I once got a postcard written by Linda Gail Lewis when I sent for info on the Jerry Lee Lewis fan club when I was about 8 in the early 70s!
	11:03am hfox: great!
	11:06am Cecile: listener doug that and you are awesome.
	11:10am Parq: Been listening most-all AM, but just got the puter now. So . . . 1) HAPPY BD CARM! Hope you will celebrate in classic style. Give yourself a treat and use one of the good glasses. 2) Speaking of FotC, Miss Trouble, my swag arrived yesterday and it included the Season One DVD I won on a drawing during one of your 'thon shifts. Many thanks. 3) Wha, any kind of toothpaste? We are toothpaste hippies and use Tom's. 4) Thanks for Nina's "Rain Today" -- God, was there any song she couldn't improve?
	11:13am annie: happy birthday carm!!!
	11:13am esch oder anarchie!: tres k&d
	11:14am Ceco;e: Parq, you must also hear Jerry Butler's version - if you haven't - of "Rain".
	11:14am Cecile: der, spell your own name right...
	11:15am north guinea hills: oh...goddamn, rahied ali continues his journey...
	11:16am Bill W: I'm late to this topic, but Nora Ephron helped kill the intelligent American comedy film (along with John Landis and John Hughes). Also, weather permitting tonight in Brighton/Coney: Blondie / Pat Benatar/ The Donnas.
	11:17am north guinea hills: his contribution to john coltrane's "interstellar space" is phenomenal
	11:24am dc pat: wow, nice version of hangin on..
	11:29am annie: i'm still listening, really really..
	11:32am Cecile: I am so sorry that Rashid Ali have left this plane.
	11:32am Cecile: has
	11:33am annie: i like the first one, better
	11:34am LizGig: I don't understand why everyone hasn't adopted a plastic bag tax yet. It's been hugely successful in reducing plastic bag pollution, and it's a completely voluntary tax. If you don't take a bag, you don't pay it. It's fantastic. Seattle, please vote for the plastic bag tax.
	11:35am annie: the anti-natural gas meetings and information sessions are riddled with people in the audience who are also placed by the drilling companies to pad the audience.. we witnessed it right here in walton.. we even asked who was there to represent the gas companies, .. a few hands actually went up.
	11:37am Ike: LizGig, yeah, we NEED a plastic bag tax but taxes of any kind are often political suicide and I'm sure Big Oil discourages that everywhere behind the scenes too. I try to remember always to take canvas bags to the supermarket. Some cashiers used to look at me like I was crazy when I said I didn't want a plastic bag, but they're getting used to it.
	11:43am Parq: Getting Americans to convert wholesale to canvas bags instead of supermarket-plastic, and also getting them to support a new tax to encourage the switch-over -- yeah, good luck with that.
	11:43am trish: 5cents per bag now in Toronto. It's had a significant effect. 70% fewer bags or something in that ball park. At the grocery store, it's odd not to have your own bag and carry plastic. Nice to have the 5cent option when you're caught wtihout, though
	11:45am LizGig: The official line on plastic bags in Ireland: http://www.environ.ie/en/Environment/Waste/PlasticBags/ (dreadfully written). Note that before the tax was introduced, 1.2 BILLION bags were used per year - in a country of fewer than 5 million people. And here's the Citizens Information page, which clearly lists the exemptions :http://www.citizensinformation.ie/categories/environment/waste-management-and-recycling/plastic_bag_environmental_levy
	11:45am north guinea hills: and as you know, nyc loves to put stuff in as many bags as possible. when i moved here 9 years ago, i couldn't believe a can of juice would be put in a paper bag and then a plastic bag...... when you tell them that you don't need a bag, that think you are crazy (as Ike mentrioned)
	11:47am trish: Ireland also had the benefit of this young woman : http://www.google.ca/search?q=Rebecca+Hosking
	11:48am still b/p: You can't count -- I say you CAN'T count -- the number of times I've stood there inattentively zoned out with a couple of canvas shopping bags tucked under my arm while the checker proceeeds to put things into plastic. The "Doh!"-cery store. Habit of bringing/using has finally gotten ahead of habit of forgettin' I brung 'em.
	11:49am trish: http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2007/nov/23/plasticbags.recycling There's a good documentary out there on the story, too. Somewhere.
	11:50am LizGig: It was like that here before the tax: shop assistants would look at you like you were nuts for not taking a bag. Once someone refused to sell me something if I didn't take a bag. But once the tax came in people's attitudes changed very quickly. However, more and more shops now have paper bags, and they will often be offered even for two items. So if you're anti-waste, you still need to be vigilant. But at least the waste is compostable.
	11:51am north guinea hills: still b/p, i'm stealing "The "Doh!"cery store" from you.lultz
	11:51am annie: this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDXjnW3nIWg
	11:53am trish: Calling it a tax is a misnomer. Consumers pay for the use of plastic bags. The bylaw in Toronto requires retailers to charge customers at least 5cents for each bag.
	11:54am dc pat: SPARKLE!! WOOOOooooOOQ!
	11:56am LizGig: It is actually a tax in Ireland. The money is remitted to Revenue. It is allegedly earmarked to fund green initiatives, but I expect it just goes into the central pot.
	11:58am trouble: hey i am psyched the seattle bag ref has sparked so much banter here...cheerio
	11:59am Ike: Still B/P, I had the same problem. I'm finally getting a handle on it.
	12:00pm Cecile: hee, Ike. handle. We have the resuable bags. We just have to remember to bring them into the store. Baby steps.
	12:00pm trish: hm! Pay for use here. One of the big grocery chains implemented the charge before it became a bylaw. Their plastic bags are the most biodegradable of all the chains, too. Tomato tomato.
	12:02pm trish: Er, they announced it before the bylaw passed. Started a month later. Edged it out on the media end, serving my memory wrong.
	12:29pm _c_: hello, I want more pere ubu. and some ctephin.

This Is The Modern World with Trouble: Playlist from August 13, 2009

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A viking ship appears on the horizon, a likeness of Alice Coltrane carved into its bow. Rare birds flock together to sing Francoise Hardy as soul hits. A sunset of blips and bleeps fills the air.

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Upcoming events:

Thu. Feb 27th, 9am - Noon: Jennifer Higgie (More info...)
This is the Modern World with Trouble welcomes Jennifer Higgie, author of The Other Side, a Story of Women in Art and the Spiritual World. Jennifer Higgie is an Australian writer living in London. She wrote fabulously for Frieze Magazine for over 2 decades, is a curator and hosted the podcast Bow Down. In honor of The Other Side coming out in paperback in the US, Jennifer and trouble will discuss women artists, seances and spiritualism.

August 13, 2009: complete swamp

Listen to this show: Pop-up listen Pop-up player!

(* = new)

Artist	Track	Album	Label	Format	Comments	New	Approx. start time
wildbirds & peacedrums	so soft so pink	the snake	the control group			*	0:00:00 (Pop-up)
mu ziq	old fun # 1 "old fun # 1" by "mu ziq"	in pine effect					0:05:41 (Pop-up)
24 carat black	i'll never let you go	gone: the promises of yesterday	numero group			*	0:13:42 (Pop-up)
rufus harley	a/9 "a/9" by "rufus harley"	bagpipes of the world/america patton harley/messiah patton harley	transparency			*	0:18:19 (Pop-up)
rolling stones	down home girl "down home girl" by "rolling stones"	now!					0:19:50 (Pop-up)
betty everett	hound dog "hound dog" by "betty everett"						0:23:40 (Pop-up)
cassaino	a casa de pedra "a casa de pedra" by "cassaino"	apresentamos nossa cassiano					0:25:53 (Pop-up)
sun ra & his intergalalctic research arkestra	theme of the stargazers	helsinski 1971: complete concert and interview	transparency				0:31:30 (Pop-up)

the coasters	down home girl "down home girl" by "the coasters"	young blood					0:35:19 (Pop-up)
the bill wells octet vs. future pilot aka	om na	kid loco dj kicks					0:38:07 (Pop-up)
j swinscoe presents the cinematic orchestra	continuum	kid loco dj kicks					0:41:35 (Pop-up)
andre hodier	jazz et jazz "jazz et jazz" by "andre hodier"	alors!!! scott mcdowell's WFMU fundraising premium 2009 v/a				*	0:43:37 (Pop-up)
lightnin slim	i'm leavin you baby	rooster blues					0:47:00 (Pop-up)
maggie sue wimberly	rock n roll simmon tree						0:49:29 (Pop-up)
dj female convict scorpion	john lee hooker	clash ups				*	0:50:43 (Pop-up)
galactic	there's something wrong with this picture	black & proud v.2	trikont				0:55:27 (Pop-up)
ceu	cangote "cangote" by "ceu"	vagarosa	six degrees			*	1:01:25 (Pop-up)

mindless boogie	dark desire ( rubber room rerub)						1:09:14 (Pop-up)
coralie clement	paris dix heures du soir	toystore					1:15:41 (Pop-up)
nina simone	I Think It's Going To Rain	the soul of nina simone					1:18:35 (Pop-up)
sandy bull	carmina burana fantasy ( based on carl orff)	fantasias	Sutro Park	Vinyl		*	1:23:01 (Pop-up)
georgia anne muldrow	return "return" by "georgia anne muldrow"	georgia anne muldrow presents...v/a					1:26:29 (Pop-up)
lisa o piu	forest echo "forest echo" by "lisa o piu"	When This Was The Future	subliminal sounds			*	1:28:22 (Pop-up)
captain beefheart	Low Yo Yo Stuff	clear spot					1:33:27 (Pop-up)
doris allen	the shell of a woman "the shell of a woman" by "doris allen"	girls girls girls v/a					1:36:43 (Pop-up)

skylab	ghost dance "ghost dance" by "skylab"	#1					1:44:16 (Pop-up)
oumou sangare	kounadya "kounadya" by "oumou sangare"	seya				*	1:49:57 (Pop-up)
japanese intelligence mind control	get the picture	girl monster v/a					1:54:28 (Pop-up)
linda gail lewis	sittin and thinkin	the women of sun records v/a					1:56:56 (Pop-up)
sleeping states	gardens of the south					*	1:59:47 (Pop-up)

massive attack v mad professor	radiation ruling the nation protection	no protection					2:05:51 (Pop-up)
alice coltrane	atomic peace "atomic peace" by "alice coltrane"	a monastic trio			http://inlog.org/2009/08/13/r-i-p-rashied-ali-1935-2009/		2:13:51 (Pop-up)
mary mccaslin	you keep me hangin on	women blue v/a	past & present			*	2:20:28 (Pop-up)
grouper	stuck "stuck" by "grouper"	dragging a dead dear up a hill					2:24:48 (Pop-up)

science fiction corporation	just walking on the moon	science fiction dance party	finders keepers			*	2:34:11 (Pop-up)
brenda holloway	i'll bbe available	the very best of					2:36:22 (Pop-up)
hercules and love affair	athene "athene" by "hercules and love affair"	hercules and love affair					2:42:33 (Pop-up)
marcio local	suingue dominou "suingue dominou" by "marcio local"						2:42:48 (Pop-up)
tami lynn	i'm going to run away from you						2:46:18 (Pop-up)
comet gain	you can hide your love forever	broken record prayers					2:48:57 (Pop-up)
sparkle moore	tiger "tiger" by "sparkle moore"	good girls gone bad v/a					2:52:37 (Pop-up)
watcha clan	goumari(dj click remix)	diaspora remixed	piranha			*	2:56:02 (Pop-up)

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Listener comments!
	9:03am annie: good morning trouble...
	9:05am trouble: good morning annie! good morning all!
	9:14am dale: another fine summer day in the northeast. the music warms things up, however.
	9:21am listener mark: good morning everyone wow, I wake up, turn on the stereo, and get hit with "I'll never let you go" Interesting way to start my day.
	9:33am annie: mark, thanks for your help with my mouse issues!! i have anew laser mouse now..
	9:33am Laurie: If it's any consolation, it's very gray and dreary looking here in Miami. By the by, how did you like Julie & Julia?
	9:37am cornliquordrinker: GOOD LAWD!
	9:37am listener mark: you 're welcome annie. How's the garden with all the rain? I must say I've got all sorts of mushrooms popping up under the trees! Strange looking!
	9:41am trouble: julie and julia: meryl streep was fantastic and charming. the julia story was presented so much better than the julie powell story. julie was made all vanilla and weepy. not like the book at all! i would highly suggest reading both the books; "julie and julia", and "my life in france".
	9:44am jiveass: Swinscoe is nice and nasteee. keep it up
	9:44am annie: mark, it has been soggy and pitiful. it seems the only things that have been happy are the carrots. the fingerlings i planted went to the blight, but the second planting of sets seems to have avoided it. i will have a fallcrop of new potatoes... i have discovered a small red mushroom in the hickory sapling grove over in the sahed area. they are tiny little things, not edible..
	9:58am Cecile: I agree, trouble, but I enjoyed it anyway. Filmmakers have a hard time portraying prickly women as likeable. And it's Nora Ephron directing. She's not so great with complexity... I also missed the omnipresence of Buffy the Vampire Slayer - in the book they are always watching Buffy.
	10:01am trouble: i agree cecile. it was enjoyable, but i always want the big cinematic experience when i see a film on the big screen vs renting netflix, i guess...
	10:07am Cecile: I had a lovely time. i went with a friend who wasn't that familiar with either, and he was enchanted so that made it for me. I agree, she should probably be doing TV movies. I like a lot of her other works much better on TV. And just think, you can netflix it and skip to all the Julia bits!
	10:17am Cecile: Sorry, killed the board. ;) Hey, trouble, did you get Season 2 of FOTC yet?
	10:18am Devin: Good morning everyone! It's thursday already?
	10:21am Cecile: randy newman wrote this song, right?
	10:25am north guinea hills: a new sandy bull release? Wow! Is it a rerelease newly found archival material?
	10:25am trouble: yes randy newman wrote i think it's going to rain. and the Flight of the conchords is on my queue, soon, soon, soon.
	10:25am listener mark: Trouble, I ordered two alice coltrane cd's "Journey In Satchidananda " and "Ptah The El Daoud" thanks for playing Alice on your radio programme.
	10:25am north guinea hills: *rerelease OR newly found archival material.
	10:27am listener mark: trouble? are you battling the plumber?
	10:30am listener mark: the noisy plumber?
	10:32am Listener Dave from NH: I suspect that the people behind the rubber room rerub are not Chicago's Rubberroom. But who knows? Maybe they've lightened up.
	10:32am PMD: Hi all--- I was away from the station yesterday, but wanted to wish Carmichael happy birthday!
	10:34am Cecile: YES BEEFHEART Happy Birthday Carm!
	10:37am what?: we queued up early and got our FOTC fix on Tuesday. it's a novel experience to (for once) get a netflix disc that isn't so scratched up i have to break out the toothpaste. first two or three episodes were a bit disappointing, but they seem to have hit their stride by the end of the first disc.
	10:39am trouble: listener mark, congratulations for entering the hallowed halls of alice coltrane. and yes i am battling the plumber, and i am winning
	10:40am Cecile: The second episode? That's astonishing! Watch it again! Sugalumps? The New Cup? But I agree, the series was a little bit wobbly at first. And the Michel Gondry ep (Unnatural Love) is brilliant. Yeah, a clean Netflix disc is awesome. I got a How I Met Your Mother (shut UP!) disc that looked like it had been dragged thru gravel by a 20 mule team.
	10:41am Cecile: Tell me about using toothpaste, though, to fix a bad disc.
	10:42am Adrian in London: (whispers) Am I the only person who just doesn't get FOTC?
	10:43am Cecile: No. You are not the only one.
	10:45am north guinea hills: classic skylab, nice! brings back memories....
	10:48am wha?: 'lil bit of toothpaste on the fingertip. 'lil bit of water on the disc. rub in tight circles (2-3 mm diameter) all around the disc. rinse and dry. it seems to work on all but most seriously pitted problem discs. forget where i heard about this technique first. i would never have tried it with my own discs, but then i don't subject my own discs to the 20-mule team (LOL, by the way) treatment.
	10:50am Cecile: Thanks!
	10:50am patrick: good morning trouble! im looking forward to seeing you!
	10:52am Listener Dave from NH: Whenever I hear the name Skylab, I always think of the old Ed Rush tune first (because I heard the song before I heard of the group) and then I'm invariably kind of taken aback for a moment by what I hear because where's the gnarly bass and the rolling drums?
	10:54am steve krinsky: Oumou is quite the presence in the Bela Fleck goes to Africa movie ("Throw Down Your Heart"); to see here walking through the streets of Bamako is a sight. And then she sings!
	10:56am trouble: good morning patrick! I am thrilled to be soon entering the great state of maine...
	11:02am Cecile: wow, space age doo-wop love it
	11:02am trouble: oumou sangare definitley has the look of someone who has tred this earth before...thousands of years of history in those hips.
	11:03am listener doug: I once got a postcard written by Linda Gail Lewis when I sent for info on the Jerry Lee Lewis fan club when I was about 8 in the early 70s!
	11:03am hfox: great!
	11:06am Cecile: listener doug that and you are awesome.
	11:10am Parq: Been listening most-all AM, but just got the puter now. So . . . 1) HAPPY BD CARM! Hope you will celebrate in classic style. Give yourself a treat and use one of the good glasses. 2) Speaking of FotC, Miss Trouble, my swag arrived yesterday and it included the Season One DVD I won on a drawing during one of your 'thon shifts. Many thanks. 3) Wha, any kind of toothpaste? We are toothpaste hippies and use Tom's. 4) Thanks for Nina's "Rain Today" -- God, was there any song she couldn't improve?
	11:13am annie: happy birthday carm!!!
	11:13am esch oder anarchie!: tres k&d
	11:14am Ceco;e: Parq, you must also hear Jerry Butler's version - if you haven't - of "Rain".
	11:14am Cecile: der, spell your own name right...
	11:15am north guinea hills: oh...goddamn, rahied ali continues his journey...
	11:16am Bill W: I'm late to this topic, but Nora Ephron helped kill the intelligent American comedy film (along with John Landis and John Hughes). Also, weather permitting tonight in Brighton/Coney: Blondie / Pat Benatar/ The Donnas.
	11:17am north guinea hills: his contribution to john coltrane's "interstellar space" is phenomenal
	11:24am dc pat: wow, nice version of hangin on..
	11:29am annie: i'm still listening, really really..
	11:32am Cecile: I am so sorry that Rashid Ali have left this plane.
	11:32am Cecile: has
	11:33am annie: i like the first one, better
	11:34am LizGig: I don't understand why everyone hasn't adopted a plastic bag tax yet. It's been hugely successful in reducing plastic bag pollution, and it's a completely voluntary tax. If you don't take a bag, you don't pay it. It's fantastic. Seattle, please vote for the plastic bag tax.
	11:35am annie: the anti-natural gas meetings and information sessions are riddled with people in the audience who are also placed by the drilling companies to pad the audience.. we witnessed it right here in walton.. we even asked who was there to represent the gas companies, .. a few hands actually went up.
	11:37am Ike: LizGig, yeah, we NEED a plastic bag tax but taxes of any kind are often political suicide and I'm sure Big Oil discourages that everywhere behind the scenes too. I try to remember always to take canvas bags to the supermarket. Some cashiers used to look at me like I was crazy when I said I didn't want a plastic bag, but they're getting used to it.
	11:43am Parq: Getting Americans to convert wholesale to canvas bags instead of supermarket-plastic, and also getting them to support a new tax to encourage the switch-over -- yeah, good luck with that.
	11:43am trish: 5cents per bag now in Toronto. It's had a significant effect. 70% fewer bags or something in that ball park. At the grocery store, it's odd not to have your own bag and carry plastic. Nice to have the 5cent option when you're caught wtihout, though
	11:45am LizGig: The official line on plastic bags in Ireland: http://www.environ.ie/en/Environment/Waste/PlasticBags/ (dreadfully written). Note that before the tax was introduced, 1.2 BILLION bags were used per year - in a country of fewer than 5 million people. And here's the Citizens Information page, which clearly lists the exemptions :http://www.citizensinformation.ie/categories/environment/waste-management-and-recycling/plastic_bag_environmental_levy
	11:45am north guinea hills: and as you know, nyc loves to put stuff in as many bags as possible. when i moved here 9 years ago, i couldn't believe a can of juice would be put in a paper bag and then a plastic bag...... when you tell them that you don't need a bag, that think you are crazy (as Ike mentrioned)
	11:47am trish: Ireland also had the benefit of this young woman : http://www.google.ca/search?q=Rebecca+Hosking
	11:48am still b/p: You can't count -- I say you CAN'T count -- the number of times I've stood there inattentively zoned out with a couple of canvas shopping bags tucked under my arm while the checker proceeeds to put things into plastic. The "Doh!"-cery store. Habit of bringing/using has finally gotten ahead of habit of forgettin' I brung 'em.
	11:49am trish: http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2007/nov/23/plasticbags.recycling There's a good documentary out there on the story, too. Somewhere.
	11:50am LizGig: It was like that here before the tax: shop assistants would look at you like you were nuts for not taking a bag. Once someone refused to sell me something if I didn't take a bag. But once the tax came in people's attitudes changed very quickly. However, more and more shops now have paper bags, and they will often be offered even for two items. So if you're anti-waste, you still need to be vigilant. But at least the waste is compostable.
	11:51am north guinea hills: still b/p, i'm stealing "The "Doh!"cery store" from you.lultz
	11:51am annie: this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDXjnW3nIWg
	11:53am trish: Calling it a tax is a misnomer. Consumers pay for the use of plastic bags. The bylaw in Toronto requires retailers to charge customers at least 5cents for each bag.
	11:54am dc pat: SPARKLE!! WOOOOooooOOQ!
	11:56am LizGig: It is actually a tax in Ireland. The money is remitted to Revenue. It is allegedly earmarked to fund green initiatives, but I expect it just goes into the central pot.
	11:58am trouble: hey i am psyched the seattle bag ref has sparked so much banter here...cheerio
	11:59am Ike: Still B/P, I had the same problem. I'm finally getting a handle on it.
	12:00pm Cecile: hee, Ike. handle. We have the resuable bags. We just have to remember to bring them into the store. Baby steps.
	12:00pm trish: hm! Pay for use here. One of the big grocery chains implemented the charge before it became a bylaw. Their plastic bags are the most biodegradable of all the chains, too. Tomato tomato.
	12:02pm trish: Er, they announced it before the bylaw passed. Started a month later. Edged it out on the media end, serving my memory wrong.
	12:29pm _c_: hello, I want more pere ubu. and some ctephin.

This Is The Modern World with Trouble: Playlist from August 13, 2009

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